A visitor to this blog drew my attention to a quote from J.R.R. Tolkien, preserved in one of his letters:
“The Lord of the Rings is of course a fundamentally religious and Catholic work; unconsciously so at first, but consciously in the revision. That is why I have not put in, or have cut out, practically all references to anything like ‘religion,’ to cults or practices, in the imaginary world. For the religious element is absorbed into the story and the symbolism.”
In my life I have read LOTR (and The Hobbit) many times and have yet to discern anything Catholic about it. Indeed, the most unreal thing about Tolkien’s imaginary world is the total absence of places of worship, clergy of any kind, sacred writings, explicit references to any deity or deities, and so on. Here on Earth there has never been a civilization that looked like that. Where would archeology be without temples, shrines, idols, etc.? Meanwhile, I’d give a lot to see the manuscript of Lord of the Rings as it was before Tolkien revised it.
I recognize Tolkien as a giant of fantasy literature, but I suggest that maybe he buried his “religious element” too deeply in the story, where hardly anyone could see it. When his work was published in paperback in the 1960s, Tolkien was appalled to find himself becoming one of the icons of the hippie movement, and more admired by pagans than by Christians. But he had only himself to blame. We can see from earlier works, published later in his life (like The Silmarillion) that, yes, Middle-Earth rested on a firm religious basis. But in Lord of the Rings hippies saw more of pipe-weed than of piety.
Well, nobody ever said it’d be easy to write compelling fantasy that serves the cause of Christ. Would Tolkien’s books had served it better if he’d left in the “religious” details that he took out? Or would the result have been something unconvincing and heavy-handed that would have pleased nobody?
I agree that Christianity, even if presented in an unearthly and fantastic form, ought to be embedded in the story–embedded, mind you: not slapped on like a decal. It’s hard to achieve this, artistically.
Readers, whom do you think are the best-ever writers of Christian fantasy–and why?
I think C. S. Lewis was the best at weaving Christianity through his stories. Everything he wrote had a Christian coloring, and even when he said something outright, he said it so skilfully that it didn’t feel jarring or heavy handed. As for Tolkien, he was a Catholic, NOT a Christian, so obviously his books weren’t going to be necessarily Christian in content. In fact, there are several places where it is Catholic, such as where it says that the Elves cry out to Elbereth for help on the sea, or something. Think Mary. I wholly agree with you that it is difficult to put Christianity in without either completely burying it, or ‘slapping it on like a decal’. I struggle with it in my own stories.
Laura, I agree with what you’ve said about C.S. Lewis and the “Christian coloring” of his works. But J.R.R. Tolkien “NOT a Christian”? Tolkien’s close friend, C.S. Lewis, who credited Tolkien with persuading him to become a Christian, would surely have been shocked to learn that Tolkien was not a Christian.
We Protestants must disabuse ourselves of the notion that Catholics are “not Christian.” There are doctrinal differences between us, to be sure. If you haven’t read C.S. Lewis’ “Mere Christianity,” I strongly recommend it. He explains better than I can how the “holy catholic Church” in the Apostles’ Creed embraces Catholics, Protestants, and Orthodox alike.
Look, if I thought the Roman Catholic Church was right about everything, I’d become a Catholic. I haven’t, so obviously I don’t. But what with secular humanists, frothing-at-the-mouth atheists, neo-pagans, and so-called “liberal churches” who turn the Bible inside-out and set themselves up as gods, we Christians have plenty of enemies to fight without turning our cannons on each other.
Well, taking Calvin’s view that Roman Catholics are Christians, I’d vote for Tolkien. I think Rich Bledsoe once said that Lewis was today’s version of John Bunyan, and Narnia the modern world’s Pilgrim’s Progress, in the sense that most Christians have read his works and have at least one book by him on the shelf. I would add that like Bunyan, Lewis is a little overt in his symbolism, in the sense that the Christianity in the books run around, shouting and waving their arms. Not that I dislike the Narnia books (aside from the first four-fifths of the Last Battle)
I think Tolkien made a good choice (though, clearly, not the only good choice available) in not making God a character in the story. After all, God isn’t a character in history, He is the shaper and ruler of history. And so Tolkien keeps God from being restrained by being placed inside the creation of the story, letting Him stand as the solution off stage, beckoning, as the one who stands behind the story, giving His good Providence to the heroes. In that way God is always present, but never seen. There’s a place for both Lewis’ and Tolkien’s ways of working within Christian fantasy, I think.
Beyond the Inklings, I think N. D. Wilson has written some terrific Christian fantasy thus far, and looking forward to his next this August.
Adam,
I love your explanation of Tolkien not making God “a character in the story” because “God isn’t a character in history,” but “the shaper and ruler of history.” That underlies the subtlety of Christianity deeply, but clearly, imbedded in The Lord of the Rings.
God is the shaper and ruler of history. Patty
Welcome back, Adam.
There are many readers who like both Narnia and Middle-Earth; I’m one of them. But you have to be pretty dense, I think, to miss the Christian symbolism in Narnia, and pretty sharp to see it in Middle-Earth. Tolkien thought Lewis overdid it, but millions of readers wouldn’t agree.
I’ve just finished writing a review of “The Narnia Code” by Michael Ward, so stay tuned.
I enjoy them both too. I fed on them both growing up, and they have a very special place in my heart. I think Narnia is subtler than many people give it credit for, but if Lewis is Bunyon, Tolkien is Flannery O’Connor, no question – both master Christian craftsmen and both requiring a ton of reflection to fill in all the meaning and symbolism.
Adam, if you think Narnia is a subtle creation, you’ll enjoy “The Narnia Code” by Michael Ward. Check it out. I’ve written a review which I suppose will eventually be posted on this blog, depending on how Chalcedon first uses it.
I can’t make a comment on this, for, with the exception of the Bell Mountain series, I can’t remember reading any Christian fantasy. I have never read J.R.R. Tolkien, nor have I read any books by C. S. Lewis. At one time I had over a 1,000 books (and had read every one), but left many behind when I moved to the Philippines. I have read three of Frank E. Peretti’s books, but I wouldn’t call those fantasy. Besides the books I had read before I became a Christian, the majority of books I now read, deal with doctrine, creation, health, science, and other such subjects, not fantasy or fiction.
Well, as far as taking Calvin’s view that Roman Catholics are Christians, I would probably argue against that view. However, God alone, is the one who makes the final determination on that. I can’t see a person’s heart, nor know their thoughts.
Much like Mike, I don’t read much fiction. When a work is billed as Christian Fiction, that can mean different things to different people. I see Lee’s writings as being governed by Christian principles and godly, though not directly mentioning Christ. Actually, I appreciate that more than a work that promotes a particular denomination.
For much of my life, I was surrounded by people who looked down upon other faiths, and felt that their own denomination was the only one practicing true Christianity. Over the years, I began to feel that this was wrong minded, and judgmental.
Obviously, we want to reject sinful behavior and steer clear of obvious wrongdoing, but I try to respect the efforts of anyone to be a follower of Christ, even if I do not see eye to eye with them.
When I worked for the Federal Government, I was surprised by all of the Catholics I met there. Many of them were devout people who sought to live clean, Christian lives. Now, I’m not about to convert, but I respect that these are people of faith, and not phonies who just show up at church to gain the approval of men.
Likewise, living where I do, there are many Mormons in the area, and many of these people lead very decent lives. While some take exception to their beliefs, I have to say that they tend to live their lives in a principled manner and apply the principles of Christianity in their day to day activities.
Judging takes place well above my pay grade, and I am certain that the sincere efforts of anyone who seeks to please their Creator will be noted. Enoch wasn’t a Christian, neither was Noah, and Abraham was neither a Christian, or even a Jew, yet these three were deemed as righteous men, in God’s site. Even in places such as Saudi Arabia and Iran, people sincerely seek to serve their Creator, even though so much as having a Bible is risky. God will see to it that all are judged fairly.
I am a Catholic Christian and I very much agree with unknowable2 and others about not judging the hearts of those who follow Christ. During these times of global persecution against Christians, we should remember Jesus Christ’s prayer during the Last Supper: “That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.” (KJV)
I know this, our Maker knows our hearts and our intentions and values everyone who truly seeks to lead a godly life.
Absolutely! Patty
You are absolutely right! Patty
Michele Dumas, there are a lot of Catholics here in the Philippines (who I get along with just fine), but like most Catholics world-wide, they have forgotten, or never knew, Church History, and certainly not Roman Catholic Church history. Some of the following information will be new to you. Please consider it prayerfully.
From Halley’s Bible Handbook:
“Summit of Papal Power:
Innocent III (1198-1216) Most Powerful of all the Popes. Claimed to be “Vicar of Christ.” “Supreme Sovereign over the Church and the World.” Claimed the right to Depose Kings and Princes, and that “All things on earth and in heaven and in hell are subject to the Vicar of Christ.”
He brought the Church into Supreme Control of the State. The Kings of Germany, France, England, and practically all the Monarchs of Europe obeyed his will. He even brought the Byzantine Empire under his control. Never in history has any one man exerted more power.
He ordered Two Crusades. Decreed Transubstantiation, Confirmed Auricular Confession, declared that Peter’s successor “can never in any way depart from the Catholic faith, Papal Infallibility. Condemned the Magna Charta. Forbade the Reading of the Bible in vernacular. Ordered the Massacre of the Albigenses. More Blood was Shed under his direction, and that of his immediate sucessors, than in any other period of Church History, except in the Papacy’s effort to Crush the Reformation in the 16th and 17 centuries. One would think Nero, the Beast, had come to life in the Name of the Lamb.”
Because of a multitude of factional historical information such as this (none of which is Godly, Christlike, or righteous), which can be found, even within Roman Catholic Church records, I cannot call the Roman Catholic Church a Christian Church. It has a foundation, that is built upon the blood of millions of martyrs of Christ.
You might want to read “Foxe’s Book of Martyrs,” a work of Protestant history and martyrology by Protestant English historian John Foxe, first published in 1563 by John Day.
Has anyone ever heard an apology from any Pope for the great evil committed by the Roman Catholic Church? Moreover, why have no Popes ever rejected all those non-biblical doctrines which have been added over the centuries (none are found in Scripture), such as the following:
• 310 – Prayers for the dead and the sign of the Cross.
• 320 – Wax Candles introduced in church.
• 375 – Veneration of angels and dead saints.
• 395 – The Mass, as a daily celebration adopted.
• 431 – Mary’s divine motherhood and her worship, was proclaimed at the Council of Ephesus. They attributed to Mary the title, “Mother of God”. Which is the Greek term,”Theotokos” and translated means “Birthgiver of God.”
This is the first of four Marian dogmas. And by virtue of Mary’s holiness, she has a role in human salvation. These dogmas have been a part of Rome’s spiritual and doctrinal patrimony for centuries. Moreover, these dogma’s have no direct basis in scripture. Nonetheless, it’s declared “divinely revealed,” meaning that it is implicitly a divine Revelation and must be embraced, because you accept Rome’s authority, nothing more.
• 500 – Priests began to dress differently from the laity.
• 593 – The doctrine of Purgatory established by Gregory the Great.
• 600 – The Latin language, as the language of prayer and worship in churches, was imposed by Pope Gregory I.
• 600 – In the early church, prayers were never directed to Mary or to dead saints. (Matt. 11:28; Luke 1:46; Acts 10:25-26, 14:14-18)
• 610 – The Papacy is of pagan origin. The title of pope or universal bishop, was first given to the bishop of Rome by wicked emperor Phocas.
• 649 – At the Council of the Lateran, the Catholic Church declared Mary’s Perpetual Virginity, that Mary was and is Virgin before, in and after Christ’s birth.
• 709 – Kissing the feet of the Pope’s feet.
• 750 – The Temporal power of the Popes began.
• 788 – Worship of the cross, images, and relics was authorized.
• 850 – Holy Water, mixed with a pinch of salt and blessed by the priest was authorized.
• 890 – The veneration of St. Joseph began.
• 965 – The Baptism of Bells was instituted by Pope John XIV.
• 995 – Canonization of dead saints by Pope John XV.
• 998 – Fasting on Fridays and during Lent (some authorities say it began in 700).
• The Mass was developed gradually as a sacrifice; and in the 11th century, attendance was made obligatory.
• 1079 – The celibacy of the priesthood was decreed by Pope Hildebrand and Boniface VII.
• 1090 – The Rosary, or prayer beads was introduced by Peter the Hermit. Copied from Hindus and Mohammedans. Counting of prayers is a pagan practice and is expressly condemned by Christ. (Matt. 6:5-13).
• 1184 – The Inquisition of heretics was instituted by the Council of Verona. Jesus never taught the use of force to spread His religion.
• 1190 – The sale of Indulgences.
• 1215 – The dogma of Transubstantiation. By this doctrine the priest pretends to perform a daily miracle by changing a wafer into the body of Christ, and then he pretends to eat Him alive in the presence of his people during Mass.
• 1215 – Confession of sins to the priest at least once a year was instituted by Pope Innocent III, in the Lateran Council.
• 1220 – The adoration of the wafer (Host), was decreed by Pope Honorius.
• 1229 – The Bible was forbidden to laymen, and placed in the Index of forbidden books by the Council of Valencia.
• 1287 – The Scapular was invented by an English monk, named Simon Stock.
It’s a piece of brown cloth with the picture of the Virgin, and supposed to contain supernatural virtue to protect from all dangers those who wear it on naked skin. This is fetishism.
• 1414 – The Roman Church forbade the cup to the laity, by instituting the communion of one kind in the Council of Constance.
• 1439 – The doctrine of Purgatory was proclaimed as a dogma of faith by Council of Florence.
• 1439 – The doctrine of 7 Sacraments affirmed.
• 1508 – The Ave Maria, part of the last half in 1508. It was completed 50 years afterward and finally approved by Pope Sixtus V, at the end of the 16th century.
• 1545 – The Council of Trent, declared that Tradition is of equal authority with the Bible.
• 1546 – The apocryphal books were also added to the Bible by the Council of Trent.
• 1560 – The Creed of Pope Pius IV was imposed as the official creed.
• 1854 – The Immaculate Conception of the Virgin Mary was proclaimed by Pope Pius IX. This dogma declares; “The most Blessed Virgin Mary, from the first moment of her conception, by a singular grace and privilege from Almighty God and in view of the merits of Jesus Christ, was kept free of every stain of original sin.”
• 1870 – Pope Pius IX proclaimed the dogma of Papal Infallibility.
• 1907 – Pope Pius X, condemned together with “Modernism”, all the discoveries of modern science which are not approved by the Church. Pope Pius IX had done the same thing in the Syllabus of 1864.
• 1931 – Pope Pius XI, reaffirmed the doctrine that Mary is “the Mother of God.”
• 1950 – The Assumption of the Virgin Mary was proclaimed by Pope Pius XII.
A distinction needs to be made between Ascension and Assumption. Jesus Christ, Son of God and Risen Lord, ascended into heaven, a sign of divine power. Mary, contrarily, was elevated or assumed into heaven, body and soul by the power and grace of God to heavenly glory.
I stand by this statement: God alone, is the one who makes the final determination on salvation. I can’t see a person’s heart, nor know their thoughts.
By bringing truthful information to those who have never seen it, doesn’t mean I hate those who follow things which are untrue. But means I love you enough to write such things, knowing some will reject it, and may hate me for bringing this to their attention.
Moreover, to those who call themselves Roman Catholic, and now knowing this information, I pray they repent, and renounce these teachings, and follow the Scriptures only, not man-made doctrines.
Mike, apparently WordPress has placed my response to your screed as a response to Unknowable. Please go read it. Goodbye.
Mike, you seem to be the one who doesn’t know much about Church history. And apparently you do read fiction, since what you’ve written here is so distorted as to be a form of fiction. For one thing, all those “decrees” you write about weren’t things that were just made up on the spur of the moment, but firm definitions — many of which you’ve described wrong anyway — of what had been taught all along but had come under dispute. You might just as well say that the divinity of Christ and the doctrine of the Trinity were invented at Nicaea. For example, the earliest records of the Church, such as the 2d century Didache and the letters of St. Ignatius of Antioch and St. Justin Martyr, both of whom knew St. John the Evangelist, assume the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist (NOTE TO UNKNOWABLE: as does the “clear statement” in John 6, and so much for going with what “the Bible clearly states”). And MIke, I could go on and on about the fictional account you’ve given us, including the weird account of the Papacy you’ve dug up from some off-the-trail Protestant screeds.
Mike, you’ve now defined everyone who doesn’t agree with your idea of Christianity as non-Christian, and have thereby (according to your previous statements about non-Christians) consigned them all to Hell, as you did with my family some time ago. I leave you and all your like-minded self-declared Popes to your own devices. I’ve had enough. I’m out of here. I won’t even answer — or read — any more of these bloviations.
I’m sorry about this, Patty, but I’ve been sitting on my hands and not saying anything up to now. This was just the last straw.
Can I suggest that the chasm between Catholicism and Protestantism is unlikely to be healed on this, or any other blog.
I have studied the Bible for many years, and I have conclusions and opinions of my own. For years, I searched for a denomination which “checked all the boxes” for my conclusions, but have never found one. Yet, I know that I have met people of many faiths who have demonstrated a sincere desire to please their Creator. I am no longer troubled by this, in great part because of the following passage.
In John 10, it states “ ‘Truly, truly, I say to you, he who does not enter the sheepfold by the door but climbs in by another way, that man is a thief and a robber. 2 But he who enters by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. 3 To him the gatekeeper opens. The sheep hear his voice, and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. 4 When he has brought out all his own, he goes before them, and the sheep follow him, for they know his voice. 5 A stranger they will not follow, but they will flee from him, for they do not know the voice of strangers.’ 6 This figure of speech Jesus used with them, but they did not understand what he was saying to them.”
Christ knows his own, and those who are sincere, will recognize the voice of their Shepherd. That call from Christ will not be indistinct.
In my career, I have met, and worked alongside people from many lands, and many backgrounds. I’ve been quite surprised by the expressions of devotion to the Creator I have heard from people who weren’t even Christian. Many Muslims truly believe that they are serving their Creator, and while it’s virtually impossible for people in some lands to convert, I suspect that when Christ returns, the way may be made for sincere persons to accept Christ as their savior.
(As an aside, one of the sweetest, most caring and sincere people I’ve ever worked with was a Muslim. He truly wants to please his Creator, but is surrounded by a culture most of us can hardly imagine. While I am not advocating for that belief system, I truly believe that someday, he will accept Christ, and I am convinced that this man’s absolute faith in his Creator will not be overlooked. Some situations, we just have to leave in God’s hands.)
Remember that in the first century, people accepted Christ and were baptized, more or less, on the spot. It wasn’t a lengthy process, and ultimately, as John 14:26 tells us: “ But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.”
So we can be glad that we have the opportunity to learn from scripture, but when push comes to shove, the calling is from Christ and those whom answer that call will have the benefit of being taught by the Spirit.
Even though I’ve studied God’s Word for well over 50 years, I don’t consider myself as being in possession of a perfect understanding. The puzzle pieces have fallen into place and I feel that I have a fairly clear understanding, but I would never conclude that I have perfect understanding.
I would suggest to all, Protestant, Catholic, non-denominational and even people who don’t profess to be Christians, to seek truth, and ask their Creator to help them learn. In the meantime, while we may have doctrinal differences, we can pray for one another, pray for understanding, but only when Christ returns, and calls His own, will we know who will respond. I can only control my own response, and pray that others of all backgrounds will answer in the positive, when Christ returns.
Thank you Unknowable for being the voice of reason. I was truly upset to have such dissension to be on the blog. Really it is to keep Lee’s work and messages alive. I appreciate your wisdom and kindness more than I can say. Patty
Phoebe, I am sorry you find truth to be so troubling. Don’t worry, you don’t have to leave this blog, I will leave, I am sorry Patty, I am gone. I will still pray for you always, and for Phoebe, you are both on my prayer list.
Just one more thing, I have always been willing to discuss any doctrine with those who disagree, for I am not afraid of truth. And at times my mind has been changed, as recorded in the books I have written.